General (main property discussion here) - Care Home?

Hi all

I will be ready to buy in a few months, is there any way i can go about getting a care home together, with a 100% mortgage? Anyway at all?

Only a small one, 4 bed etc. Any ideas?

Matt

yeah i've been thinking about this as well

i've got a mate who works for a couple who bought a four bed detached and employs her to look after them. next time i see her i'll find out about it and let you know.

dunno about the mortgage like coz the companys don't like multiple lets - too risky. but i suppose if you can source a house 15-20%bmv (shouldn't be too hard at the minute) you can get mortgages based on the valuation rather than purchase price,so in theory would cover deposit (as long as rental valuation weighs up)get some sort of business loan then ship em in. lol

if its this easy let me know!!!

Chris - I have done my research and figures on this already, ive even spoken to a guy who just sold a care home to a couple and he told me all the ins and outs of the costs.

So im quite knowledgeable in this now, my email is MatthewJHolland@hotmail.co.uk - if you fancy giving me a shout on there, i can share my info with you, maybe even go in together (would be safest for 1st home). You will like the figures ;o)

Matt

hi i've sent you an e-mail

matthew,

depending on how confidential your figures are could you shares the bare bones with us.

like returns and the average rent per room, cost for a full time carer etc.

did feel you have to give anything away that is confidential.

thanks,

tom

Hi Tom

I really dont mind giving my figures to other investors mate, its just a bit of a kick in the teeth when im finding it so difficult to do anything ive planned, and i share it with others, and they have access to mortgages and cash all over the place...lol.

Can i email them over?

Matt

I'm following this thread with interest. Sounds like an interesting idea.

How's the plans going Matt ? You resolved your deposit issue yet ?

FM

sorry for not responding on this matt,

email is tomharwood88@hotmail.com

i await with interest!

tom

Email sent!

Funky - no, i cant sort out 30k, so my only option is gifted or cashback deals.

Or bank robbery ;o)

Matt

Matt,

Have you tried the money centre ? There is at least one lender who lends on the value of the property as opposed to the purchase price. So if the income stacks up and you get the property slightly BMV (which I'm sure you will try) then you may be able to finance 100% or near to. There are 89 % mortgages out there too which may help.

Alternatively, might you be interested in doing a JV ?

Could you send me the numbers to look at, I'm interested in the sort of yield you are looking at.

Regards,

FM.

Yes sure, can i have your email address please?

Matt

Hi Matt I have logged into this website for the first time tonight and have just read your thread, am very interested to whether care homes are profitable? As it wasn't long ago, Care Home Owners were all selling up because the amount per head the Councils would pay per resident was becoming impossible to balance against the wages for the carers. If at all possible I would be very interested in seeing the figures you have? Have you sorted out your deposit yet? If not, if it is such a good deal, why not approach some private investor groups? Wendy

Hi Wendy, Care homes are very profitable, no i havnt sorted a deposit yet, im 22, and theres no way i, or any other 22 year old can get hold of many thousands of pounds for a deposit.

I dont know any private investor groups, any hints?

Whats your email address, i'll email my figures right over, just to state, my figures came from a man, who just sold a care home to a family, all monthly out-goings are covered, and its still profitable.

I just wish someone here would help me out, as ive done alot of research and i cant get on the ladder at all.

If anyone does want the figures, just leave your email and i can whip them right over.

Matt

matt,

received the email - thanks. let me know if you didn't get my response.

tom

Hi Matt

Could you send me the figures too just out of interest?

Yes, need your email though mate.

Matt I am very interested in your figures for a care home, and if you have heard of any for sale I am new to this site, I am also a psychiaris nurse in the community and we tend to place clients in homes, but i deal mostly with adults with mental health who do not need a lot of input depending of what caterory you specialise in the care home Do email me, my address is nadcok@msn.com

Email sent.

I dont specialise in any area, these are figures that ive put together with an ex care home owner who gave me the ins and outs.

Some new information i have learnt is that its best to have 1 full time manager, and 1 part time manager on the books (both fully qaulified), this is so that if the full time manager leaves, you have the part time manager still on the books, as if you own a care home without a full time fully qaulified manager, its illegal and will be shut down.

You can find many homes in the UK with 5+ bedrooms at http://www.rightmove.co.uk, if you look around, you may find homes that you can refurb the attic to create 2/3 more bedrooms depending on size.

If you place people in homes, this could be a great idea for you.

Matt

Nana - your email address didnt work, can you check it.

Thanks

Matt

Hi Matt. Sorry for the delay replying, Been in Africa with work.

Funkyme@ntlworld.com

Regards,

FM

Hi Matt Sorry I have only just read your reply to me on the Landlord Traders Forum, I have been away - yes please could you send the figures to me on the Care Home. I will look up the email address you need for the Private Investors, they are property investors that are in touch with people that are interested in good investments. Wendy swiftsolutions@blueyonder.co.uk

Hi Matthew, I have recently seen an "ex-care home" up for auction.I am not in a position to pursue it,but it may be of some interest to you to.I think that it is the Manchester area,with a guide price of 100k.If you are intersted let me know and I will dig out the info for you..... I would appreciate your financial calculations,I am sure that it will add to my knowledge. Good luck. simonp@wanadoo.fr

Hello again Matthew, Just looked at that site again.The auction is on the 13th July 2005,BUT the guide is 200-250k,very sorry!.I would still like your info please. Regards.

Hi Matt,

Thanks for the figures. I've had this question that's been nagging in the back of my mind for the last week or so.... It may sound silly but ; Care homes, shouldn't they ideally be on a single floor or if not have a lift, in which case, what about the renovation costs in your figures. In fact I didn't see any allowance for conversion at all. Or are you looking at buying an existing care home property ?

And if so, I guess those figures are pretty accurate then !

If not, then I assume you have factored the conversion costs into the purchase price at £320k. In which case, how much do you reckon that the building conversion would cost based on the 9 bedrooms you are talking about. I assume you need fire doors installed and all the other regulations that have to be met, furniture and TV's in each room (ones that have a min volume level of 120decibels - obviously ;o) ) etc.

Which gets me round to thinking that I'd "guestimate" about £30k - 50k for the works and that means that you're probably looking at properties with a price tag of about £270k to £290k. So then I'm thinking.... where abouts in the country can you get a 9 bedroomed house for that sort of cash. I can't even buy a 3 bed for that where I live.

So pray do tell... where abouts you looking dude ?

Regards,

Funky Me (Part time Nosey Parker / Inspector Morse)

Hi Funky

As stated, my figures are based only on someone elses care home, on 3 floors, for £320k, it didnt need any renovation, because it was already a care home, in kent.

Im not looking for a care home, my 1st property will be a BTL. I just found a care home quite interesting.

Matt

Funky Me, Have you considered purchasing former guest houses that would have had all the regs complied with? This would remove the need for expensive renovations. There are quite a few guesthouses for sale especially those whose businesses are no longer viable who would sell well BMV. HTH ruth

A friend pointed out that the figures were a bit out, so i need to re-work them, i had no idea i was going to get such a response with them lol.

Care homes are still very profitable, if there figures stack up!

I will change them ;o)

Matt

Hi Matt and anyone else who may be interested, I have found details of a former 43 bed council care home in Lancashire.Guide price 225 - 275k. The bad news is that there is a clawback of 50% if the site become private housing within 20 years. If anyone would the auction details,let me know.Matt I would still like your calculations please. simonp@wanadoo.fr

Matt : oic, I'm with you now.

Ruth : That's an interesting thought Ruth, thanks. PS what's the HTH stand for ?

Simon : Is that 50% clawback of whatever it sells for at Auction, or 50% of the resale value when developed ? I'm interested in looking at the auction details anyway. Funkyme@ntlworld.com

HTH- hope this helps :) ruth

Thanks Simon,

Looks like you could get about 12 houses on the site !